Welcome To V6Mustang.com!

We are the oldest and largest V6 Mustang forum on the internet. If you have any questions about your V6 Mustang or just want to connect with other V6 Mustang owners around the world, you have found the best place on the internet to do that.

Registering is free and easy! Hope to see you on the forums soon!

M122 Supercharger Install Complete

Discussion in 'Personal Projects and Builds' started by bmckelvey, Mar 15, 2014.

  1. bmckelvey

    bmckelvey FordV6Guy

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2005
    Messages:
    84
    Likes Received:
    48
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    Madison, AL
    I have removed the M112 setup and am progressing on the M122 setup. The M112 worked great and provided super HP and Torque improvements ... But ... I still want to test the M122 on my V6. I believe, from looking at the pressure maps and other info on the M122 it will operate in a higher efficiency range than the M112. Also, I like the look of the intake port on the M122. There are some positive things and some negative things about this install. First, having the S/C intake on the LH side of the motor gives a shorter and more direct path to the MAF and airbox, but now I need to relocate the coil pack. Also, the bottom side of the M122 is significantly different and I need to move it ahead about 1.5", however, this works better for the pulley alignment. The base of the M112 is flush with the discharge side of the S/C where the M112 has the discharge about 5/8" above the base. Moving the M122 ahead 1.5" means extending the front of the manifold so it clears the discharge from the S/C. Going to be a busy weekend. I hope to have the adapter plate done today and a plan for all the other required changes. Have to move my SNOW controller and fuel splitter block. I already installed the GT500 airbox. This is where the M122 will sit .....
    M122OnMotor.jpg
     
    john f and Markstang like this.
  2. Phil II

    Phil II Cone Destroyer Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2013
    Messages:
    1,442
    Likes Received:
    214
    Trophy Points:
    73
    Location:
    Columbia, South Carolina
    Looks very promising. Is the blower a little more compact?
     
  3. bmckelvey

    bmckelvey FordV6Guy

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2005
    Messages:
    84
    Likes Received:
    48
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    Madison, AL
    The blowers are dramatically different in shape and orientation. The M122 is an inch shorter than the M112 but the mounting width is identical. The M122 snout is about 2 1/4 inches shorter than the M112, but the front of the shaft is only 1/2 inch shorter when you measure from the face of the mounting plates. The discharge openings are quite different in shape and the two most important things are; first, the distance from the front of the M122 to the bypass port is 2 inches longer than the M112, and second the M122 discharge is flush with the mounting face where the M112 is 5/8 inch recessed. The key difference for the install is that the discharge opening needs to move one inch forward and the bypass opening is one inch further back so the overall opening in the new intake manifold is 2 inchs longer. The good news ... the shaft diameter is the same so I was able to use one of my M112 pulleys. The M122 pulley sits way back on the nose of the S/C about 2 inches. You can see how far by the length of the machined surface of the nose. Also, I flipped the M112 pulley around so it sits about 3/4 inch further out as well. I finished the adapter plate yesterday and we are going to the shop today to modify one of our machined intakes. I was could have used the fabricated intake from the M112, but we are almost finished the intake prototype so I will use it. This will also give anyone interested in my new aluminum machined intake pictures of the installation.

    M112_M122_Comparison.jpg
     
  4. bmckelvey

    bmckelvey FordV6Guy

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2005
    Messages:
    84
    Likes Received:
    48
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    Madison, AL
    The adapter plate is complete and fits perfectly. The EGR fits without an adapter, that will save a few hours work!
    AdapterPlate1.jpg
     

    Attached Files:

    • EGR1.jpg
      EGR1.jpg
      File size:
      120.8 KB
      Views:
      302
  5. Phil II

    Phil II Cone Destroyer Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2013
    Messages:
    1,442
    Likes Received:
    214
    Trophy Points:
    73
    Location:
    Columbia, South Carolina
    Looks really good. You move quick. Got three questions:

    Do you tap the adapter for the fasteners, or are there nuts underneath it?
    Does the blower pulley seem properly supported even thought its backwards?
    Are you considering a secondary idler to help wrap the blower pulley and better wrap the accessory on the driver's side cylinder head (p/s pump?)?
     
  6. bmckelvey

    bmckelvey FordV6Guy

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2005
    Messages:
    84
    Likes Received:
    48
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    Madison, AL
    I tap the adapter plate, no room for nuts under the plate. I drill the base hole in my drill press, then I put the tap in the drill press and use my hand to turn the tap in to the material 3 or 4 turns. This assures that the holes will be 100% vertical when I finish tap the rest of the way through.
    The pulleys are on the shaft the full length of the hole in the pulley, they are fully supported.
    I have not made the secondary idler bracket yet. It is shorter than the one on the M112 so I need to fabricate a new secondary pulley adapter plate.
     
  7. bmckelvey

    bmckelvey FordV6Guy

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2005
    Messages:
    84
    Likes Received:
    48
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    Madison, AL
    I did not get much done last night, wife and I went out for dinner. I did do a few things this morning early. I will be busy at work this week so won't make much progress until the weekend. Here is the adapter for the new 70 mm throttle body, I will be porting it and making a smooth transition from the round to oval shape. I moved the coil to the RH side of the engine. The new throttle body is already recalibrated but I still need to drill and tap the hole for the water/methanol injector.
    TB AdapterAndCoil.jpg
     
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2014
    badbrad likes this.
  8. Markstang

    Markstang Polishing my banhammer Staff Member

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2012
    Messages:
    1,004
    Likes Received:
    74
    Trophy Points:
    58
    there's no oval or twin blade throttle body you could use instead of your 70mm?
     
  9. bmckelvey

    bmckelvey FordV6Guy

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2005
    Messages:
    84
    Likes Received:
    48
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    Madison, AL
    Good question ;) I already have a twin blade. I want to run all 3 throttle bodies on the dyno to see what the results are. My adapter will allow me to run both the stock and 70 mm throttle bodies. We always see manufacturers promoting their aftermarket products claiming certain power gains or saying ambiguous things like ... "significant power gains" ... I like to see just how much gain there is. And, for the guys on a limited budget where $300+ is lot of money, first questions is, will my stock throttle body work? You can always upgrade later. Second question is, how much HP gain will I see if I replace my TB with a larger one? I made 284 RWHP and 323 RWTQ using the stock 4.0 SOHC throttle body with the M112 setup. With this setup I am going to try all three throttle bodies (stock 65mm, 70 mm and twin blade) and have some real test numbers from the dyno! Again, my objective is always to try and keep my project engines under $1000 since I build a couple of different setups each year.
    ThrottleBodies.jpg
     
  10. Phil II

    Phil II Cone Destroyer Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2013
    Messages:
    1,442
    Likes Received:
    214
    Trophy Points:
    73
    Location:
    Columbia, South Carolina
    I think the v8 crowd proved conclusively that PD blowers appreciate minimum restriction on the inlet. The best t/b for performance would then be a mono-blade. Cost is the big issue.

    One other draw back of those is very high throttle sensitivity, which can be a drive-ability issue. My own t/b is the dragon piece. I can stick my fist in it with a little room to spare. It has a progressive linkage which helps a lot with small throttle inputs. I suppose a drive-by-wire throttle can be programmed to be progressive too.

    Why did you mount the smaller t/b off set, not centered on the plenum flange? I would guess that either centered or off-set to the outside of the turn would offer the smoothest flow, but I'm only guessing. Or could you just turn the adapter around?
     
  11. bmckelvey

    bmckelvey FordV6Guy

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2005
    Messages:
    84
    Likes Received:
    48
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    Madison, AL
    I agree that PD blowers like minimum restriction, just like turbos, in fact turbos are more sensitive to intake restriction. My objective is to determine how much difference is there between the T/B's I have. The drive by wire can be programmed and that is one thing my buddy at the dyno will do as I switch between T/Bs.
    I mounted it offset because the drive motor assembly extends out the back and I would have had to make the adapter an inch thick to clear the intake and still have material for the adapter to seal the oval intake opening. Could have done that but because this is a blower motor I don't think that location is going to have much impact.
    And, If I can make 300 HP from a V6 for $1000, is it worth it for me to spend another $1000 for 25-50 more HP? For a guy racing the answer would be yes. For a daily driver, it depends on how much money you have to spend on your car. My view is I'd spend the $1000 and then as I had the money I would progressively buy the other upgrades. The big buck build comes the day you exceed the capability and reliability of your street driven V6 and need to spend a few thousand to reinforce all the internals to support in excess of say 325 RWHP ... and if you ask a dozen different people what is the max RWHP for a 4.0 SOHC you will get a dozen different answers. The truth is a guy with a standard transmission can break the tranny and engine of a stock setup with the wrong driving style. I like to be around 300 RWHP for my everyday driven Mustang V6. I find that it is relaible, competitive on the street and fun to drive.
     
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2014
    badbrad likes this.
  12. bmckelvey

    bmckelvey FordV6Guy

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2005
    Messages:
    84
    Likes Received:
    48
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    Madison, AL
    Did not get a lot done this weekend. We worked most of Saturday at my buddy's shop. We finished 2 supercharger manifolds that I started a new thread on. And after I helped him finish a few things it was time to take the wives out for dinner, music and a little dancing. Late night, so I started late today working on the car. I think I put the supercharger in place on the engine and pulled it back out about 20 times ... Wish they made these out of light weight plastic!! I got everything lined up and looking for potential problems. I finally got all the mounting holes drilled in the adapter plate to the aluminum intake, Also got the EGR pipe completed, sourced from a wrecked Explorer ($5), cost me $12 for the 2 splice pieces at Lowes. Made sure that the pulley alignment is perfect. Drilled and tapped all the mounting holes for the adapter plate in the intake once I was sure everything was 100% lined up. I clamped the plate and intake together, drilled the nominal hole through both, then I unclamped and drilled the bolt hole in the plate and beveled and recessed for the head of the Allen head bolt in the plate and tapped the holes in the intake manifold. I test assembled everything ... goes together great. Then took it all apart and will assemble as soon as I get 4 longer bolts for the corner holes. If I had those 4 bolts I could have installed everything tonight :(. A few pictures from today ...
    EGRPipe.jpg AdapterPlate.jpg TapPlateHoles.jpg M122InPlace.jpg
     
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2014
    Brent and Markstang like this.
  13. badbrad

    badbrad the bradinator

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2009
    Messages:
    220
    Likes Received:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    hueytown, al
    that looks really good!
     
  14. 6 Shooter

    6 Shooter Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2013
    Messages:
    1,347
    Likes Received:
    226
    Trophy Points:
    73
    Location:
    Dallas, TX
    That is some very sexy machine work. Gotta love those standing milling machines.
     
  15. Phil II

    Phil II Cone Destroyer Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2013
    Messages:
    1,442
    Likes Received:
    214
    Trophy Points:
    73
    Location:
    Columbia, South Carolina
    Is your m122 adapter two pieces? Do you need to keep EGR to comply with your state laws?
     
  16. bmckelvey

    bmckelvey FordV6Guy

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2005
    Messages:
    84
    Likes Received:
    48
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    Madison, AL
    The M122 assembly is 2 pieces, the machined intake and the adapter plate. I could have made it in one piece, but then I would have had to make separate manifolds for every combination of supercharger install. This way all that is required is to make an adapter plate which is easy. There is no inspection of vehicles in Alabama, but I like to keep the install as emission compliant as possible. This also makes sure I don't get any ECU 'Check Engine' light

    I finished everything this morning except the air tube between the MAF and throttle body!! It fired right up, only ran it a couple of minutes because I did not have the air pipe on, but sounds great. Here are pictures of the completed setup without the air tube. I will start the air tube tonight. It will be made of fiberglass. I will make the mold first, wrap it in Saran Wrap and then fiberglass over the mold. I have done this a few times before and it looks really good after it is sanded and painted. The fiberglass also allows me to add the vent tube and is light weight. It will take a couple of days to get that done. Notice that I get the idler pulley up close for about a 3/4 wrap on the supercharger pulley to be sure it won't slip. That little bracket on the fan shroud supported the air tube on the M112 ... I'm going back out right now to remove that :).

    M122_1.jpg M122_2.jpg M122_3.jpg
     
  17. bmckelvey

    bmckelvey FordV6Guy

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2005
    Messages:
    84
    Likes Received:
    48
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    Madison, AL
    Too cold to fiberglass in the garage tonight. But I did get the pattern made. Now I will wrap it with Saran Wrap and fiberglass over the pattern, then remove the pattern. Hopefully it will warm up for tomorrow night.
    IntakeTube1.jpg IntakeTube2.jpg
     
    badbrad likes this.
  18. Phil II

    Phil II Cone Destroyer Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2013
    Messages:
    1,442
    Likes Received:
    214
    Trophy Points:
    73
    Location:
    Columbia, South Carolina
    Neat. Is the MAF in the air box?
     
  19. bmckelvey

    bmckelvey FordV6Guy

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2005
    Messages:
    84
    Likes Received:
    48
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    Madison, AL
    Yes, the MAF is in the stock location in the air box.
     
  20. toph6888

    toph6888 Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2012
    Messages:
    503
    Likes Received:
    56
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Looking good. Did you just use painters tape to make that mold?

    Also, supercharger looks good on there. One thing I always look for is how much belt wrap there is, so many people seem to leave this part out and end up having isses with belt slippage, but having that pulley on there right next to the blower really gives you a lot of wrap, nice job.

    One comment on RWHP limits, its always hard to put a number on that like you said with the way its driven, supercharger vs turbo (since the PD/roots supercharger puts down a lot of torque to start and the bottom end has to support more abuse then a turbo does to make the same hp/tq, all in the curve), but also supporting mods (where the weak links are, either in clutch, trans, or if the tires have too much traction, eventually something will let go if they aren't balanced).

    Looking good man, keep it up.